Dio's Femfight Community Forum

tomas · Senior Member

DWW screws up

JSK · Senior Member

I know people are saying Bush has screwed up America, Iraq, the moon ... but now DWW? (LOL) Quickly took a jot over there and saw nothing about it.

Its mainly the cost of business and with a growing internet changes are always needed. As for online credit card processors? Well we can blame them for sure. Visa the biggest crooks in the book impose initial payoff's to use their services and then an annual one every so often a year. Nothing that would break a top notch catfight site, but theres a reason for everything. Women wrassler's aint cheap!!! Neither is some hosting companies and/or bandwidth. And time equals money too.

Online credit card processing companies go by the banks fees. Here in the states they blame the Euro and charge more to do business. And, the same goes with anyone out of the states dealing with us. Its a no win ... well I mean they win. And they come first leaving the site owners last to be paid after they've eaten enough of your money. Like my site DWW got theived from Ibill a former online credit card company and they took it like champs. And, lets just say they got screwed out of alot more money than me and never saw an increase in prices then. Thats top notch and believe me it wasn't chump change they lost at that time.

I dunno. Love DWW and mean nothing by it, but with all the memberships as shown on their stat report multiplied by price? They should be well, but then again things happen and you gotta respect that. Thankfully they are a great company and site so their charge/fee's are justifiable. Atleast I think so. Again ... Its not like they increase membership price each year like some may do.

As for the megapixel, screen depth thingy ... I'll save that for another day or something.

Lata!
JSK

tomas · Senior Member

Americans blame the euro. Europeans blame the dollar. (Meanwhile, the Chinese are laughing their asses off.)

DWW's prices are very reasonable. The credit system is a pain in the ass, but I suppose it's necessary to avoid handing over too much money to CCBill. What I disapprove of is just the trick of announcing a price increase that didn't happen.

And DWW must be doing very well. While some companies seem to release every snippet of catfighting that they film to try to maximize sales, DWW has a vast archive of unreleased material. They've been feeding us a new Luzia clip every couple of months, despite her taking a hiatus two years ago.

JSK · Senior Member

Yeah if the chinese aint laughing they must be painting toys for "Murkins"!!!

As you can see I'm not really the one to go between a gripe with DWW ... they've always been cool to me and helpful throughout the years. I understand your gripes and they aint too bad. Its good to vent in a way and question. After all sounds to me like you are a huge supporter than anything else.

Hmmm ... so their prices didn't go up then? Well, thats kind of a good thing then. And, these tokens, tickets and stocks these companies sell baffle me. Too confusing, but it is to insure that one exclusive credit card transaction company doesn't pocket it all. We live ... we learn.

I will hand it to DWW because yeah although they have been in the business since the fall of Rome they still make new stuff, deal with customers accordenly and have fair prices. I could make a list of a zillion other companies that brag about being in business since the 80's or 90's but still bring out an old ass film and say NEW RELEASE!!! I guess they are new to some.

And, I really can't bash "green monster" because they are from my hometown :)
Sure, they are young but hopefully stay in the game long enough. Long enough for me to make it to one of their damn events!!! I was asked but couldn't attend a year or two ago. Long story but great reason for not being able to make it. A cleaner style of wrasslin which is cool to some and I think they will catch on.

Have a good one Tomas. Always good to hear from ya. Is there anyone else here or are we the only ones who like chicks fightin and stuff!?! :)

JSK

Kent · Senior Member

Has Eva N ever fought Kati (Kirsten Dunst's double)? That looks like a great matchup of very feminine girls, but I'm not sure of the size comparison.

My problem with DWW is that their catelog is so huge, and the purchasing methods are hard for me to figure out. It seems like the movies download option is very limited while the DVDs have more choices. Also, it seems like their DVDs go out of print (I can still kick myself for not getting "Eva's Evolution" [different Eva] where she first fought Melanie).

tomas · Senior Member

Sorry, Kent, I doubt that Kati and Eva ever fought. I believe Kati had already left when Eva first started fighting about two years ago. Moreover, Eva is Czech and Kati Hungarian. The last video I have with Kati gives her size as 5'7"/115lb. Eva is 5'4"/117lb in this newest download. I would certainly have liked to see them fight. Intuitively, I'd give it to Eva. She's more aggressive, generally fights rougher, and has been more successful in her fights. (Kati faced far tougher opponents though.)

If you want to see Eva against someone very feminine, you might enjoy her fight against Sarah. I think it's the first competitive fight for both of them (after several erotic fights against each other), so Eva's much weaker than nowadays, but they're both absolutely gorgeous. Too bad the video is much too bright. Eva's fight against Monika is excellent novice wrestling, but I guess Monika is a bit of an acquired taste.

And you're not the only one who's bewildered by the size of DWW's catalogue - the producers themselves don't know it very well. Last time I was a web club member, there was this hilarious Luzia fan in the member's forum who kept on correcting the owner about the details of Luzia's career.

You should be able to find most current DVDs as downloads as well. The reverse is not true - the downloads marked FOM and MOVIES are online only. I only buy downloads, because by now I have my favourite girls and want to be able to cherry-pick individual fights as I please.

-- Edited by tomas at 02:11, 2007-12-08

Kent · Senior Member

Thanks, tomas. I think if I start buying from DWW again I may use your knowlege as a resourse. You know your stuff and have the right taste in girls, too.

The two links you posted about her fight with Sarah and Monika were dead. I'm not sure why. I was going to try to search for these fights by using their Fighter Database, but I think that Eva N isn't listed on there at this time. Can you check if the links were broken?

Thanks. I'm going to put some more thought into DWW.

Kent · Senior Member

tomas, looks like the link isn't dead, looks like the whole site is dead. Something must be up with their server.

Panther100 · Veteran Member

Tomas, as far as your issues with HD video, if anybody really bothers to SEE a Big Dif between standard DVD and high-definition DVD and then is dissatisfied the way the high-definition DWW products are playing AFTER they're honestly told the product is still 640 x 360, I say G.R. has some confusion to clear up big-time; otherwise, I don't see this as a Big Problem. I completely agree on your focus, but who's gonna take the time to buy the product in each format (let's assume you could do that) and compare ??? O.K., maybe some people would, but if, after you get going (as you do), it makes no difference compared to standard DVD, who cares ??? ... DWW being amateurish ? ... more like "misleading," but, if you're happy, you'll fire off an e-mail to G.R., ask him what's going on, ... he'll give you a good answer or somehow make it up to you ... you'll still be a happy customer ... he'll still be a damn good pro ... and everybody will be content and the good life goes on.

Now, about price ...

I understand your reservations about DWW about this, but a loyal fan of DWW or any other site probably isn't gonna be too upset about the timing of advance sales or price "puffery" (even if it would go so far as to qualify as "deception").

No, not when you know the quality of what you're buying.

You were told a price increase is on the way ??? ... It turns out somebody was just tryin' to motivate you to spend now or be sorry later ??? ... Sorry for what ??? ...

If you're talkin' about a sporadic fan, yeah, THAT fan might feel "cheated," but even then he or she KNOWS what his or her money is going to fetch, and in the long run isn't gonna feel bad. Translation: No need for DWW or a similar pro to worry ... NOBODY's gonna raise hell or ask for a refund ... no ... it just isn't gonna happen. About the worse I can imagine is an unhappy fan who doesn't take too well the "selling" of advance timing of an impending (false ?) price boost might ask for some accommodation ... say, ... some complimentary credits. The reason is that if you spend in advance, even under "misleading" pretenses, you know what your future product is gonna be--very well worth the money--so what are you gonna feel that bad over ??? ... Not very much, imho.

I would say so even IF such potential price increases failed to materialize.

JSK throws in some great points regarding the pro's costs of doing business, the bank credit card and 'Net payment processors, extraneous fees, etc. Hell, everything considered, it's sometimes amazing how the e-businesses who rely solely on 'Net income can stay in business. As an aside, somebody asked on another board what customers think about automatic, recurring billing. I said fine with me. Anything that helps the pro's help THEMSELVES do better is absolutely fine with me.

I never heard ANYone say they have a problem with a company because the catalog is so huge. May every pro be the target of such problems !!! ... and if they themselves need updating or correcting, may they themselves ALWAYS have such loyal fans who will do that !!! I've never had a problem with figuring out DWW's or any other pro's purchasing methods, although I do hate it when a product is discontinued. (All you pro's hear that ??? ... Just STORE it somewhere ... DON'T throw it out !!! ... They'll still GO !!! ... even after a long time, ... repeat, ... they'll eventually GO AGAIN !!!) One time I had a couple questions about credits and G.R. promptly answered that.

Great points by everybody above.

[Attn: Lard Grant -- Your "re-born" stem-cell self (Mulelysses Ass Grant) wants your advice on pullin' his fat head outta his fat ass. He says it helps your brain stay warmer now that the weather is colder, but if you'd only get your fat ass covers like he told you, he wouldn't hafta keep it up there.]

Kent · Senior Member

tomas,

Hell, Monika looks great! She seems to be a better size match up for Eva (I'm big on that), but maybe the Sarah match was just as exciting. Do you recommend these two matches as a nice intro to Eva? I'm definitely looking into this instead of the Modelfight Russian fights I was thinking of going for next.

tomas · Senior Member

Kent, the links are working as I'm writing this. Their server might be down for maintenance occasionally, but if it occurs just as you're downloading a video file, you'll still have access to the file for several days to resume your download. I'd be glad to give you my opinions about DWW's fighters or individual fights. Just keep in mind that even though I've been a regular customer for ten years, I've still only seen a fraction of their stuff.

(EDIT: Just saw your last post. I'll have a quick look at the fights I've bought with Eva to refresh my memory, and then you'll have my opinion.)

Panther, my gripe about the video format only concerns the term "high definition". At least here in Europe, this term has nothing to do with our subjective experiences of a video's quality: it's an explicit industry standard that requires a video file to be at least 720 vertical pixels. Any video that has 360 vertical pixels is per definition (no pun intended) not HD. You can't call a triangle a square by any means. I see this as amateurish because I don't believe anyone would deliberately make such an obvious mistake if they knew about the formal requirement for HD. I take it that somebody at DWW must have been inspired by all this HD craze with Bluray discs, digital television, digital cinema projection and whatnot, without realizing that you can't just call any video format HD simply because it's an improvement on the previous format.

If the HD quality had been a factor in my decision to buy the video, I'd have been pissed off. As it happens, I would have bought this rematch in just about any quality, so I'm just irritated and a little embarrassed that they're advertising this as HD.

About the announced but never realized price raise, perhaps it's just a personal reaction I get every time somebody tries to deceive me.

I think I've expressed my views about over-saturated product catalogues in another thread. If your catalogue contains piss-poor stuff in addition to great stuff, then a new customer who happens to choose one of your third-rate fights will assume that it's representative of your total output, and he'll stay away from you in the future. If you produce 100 great fights and 100 that are merely so-so, I don't think it's necessarily a good choice to release all 200. After all, for any customer there's a limited amount of fights that he'll ever consider buying. Why not make it more likely that he'll choose really good fights, be a happier customer, and return to you when he's ready for more?

I realize of course that it's partly a question of taste and that there won't always be full agreement on whether one particular fight is better than the other. But I assure you that I've seen some pretty bad snoozers from DWW that I can't imagine anybody preferring over such gems as Luzia vs Barbara or this most recent fight with Eva vs Marketa.

-- Edited by tomas at 22:40, 2007-12-10

tomas · Senior Member

All right, to sum up my thoughts on Eva's videos:

Eva vs Monika was my first exposure and made me fall in love. I just rewatched it. This is novice wrestling for pins and submissions. In light of Eva's later fights, it's remarkable that there are no leg scissors at all in this one. You'll see long full body presses, evolving into schoolgirl pins or breast smothers. The pleasure is in watching both girls really straining to heave each other off. Although this is a slow fight, neither girl gets defensive. The pins are long, but there's always a good struggle going on, not just one girl lying on top of the other and stalling. A LOT of breast to breast contact. Regarding the size match-up, Monika is a bit taller but not conspicuously (I took the liberty of attaching a screenshot to this post). They match each other quite well in terms of skill too. This is my top recommendation, if you like beginner's wrestling and don't mind the limited number of pins.

Two reservations: There are two people off-camera cheering intermittently in Czech, and some helicopter noise(!) for half a minute. The clip is about 26 minutes, but 6 of those consist of a staredown, arm-wrestling, a breast-to-breast contest of strength, post-match hugging and posing, and a couple of interview questions for Eva.

Eva vs Sarah is an earlier fight. The action is both much quicker when they get into it and much more defensive when they run out of steam. In her fight against Monika, Eva had a clear objective in the schoolgirl pin. Here, it's more random as they tumble around without really knowing how to score. They're evenly matched. Somebody screwed up with the choice of camera lens, so the video is much too bright. Despite this, I keep it in my special folder because the combined beauty of these two is just amazing. I've attached a screenshot, which also illustrates the lighting problem.

Eva vs Silvia was probably shot back to back with the fight against Monika. It's less evenly matched, both in terms of strength and size (Silvia is a bit on the squat side), but still intense, and it has the same long full body presses.

Moving on to the later videos, Eva vs Jenny is Eva's most hard-fought match if you go by the end result. Here, she's become far more adept and knows how to use her leg scissors. Intense back-and-forth action, verging on a catfight, with both girls getting more frustrated with each other as neither has the upper hand for very long. It would have been my top recommendation, except Jenny's really not my type, and...

Spoiler: ...it's an inconclusive draw, with the promise of a rematch.

Eva vs Marketa, first encounter, is like a preliminary version of this most recent catfight. Here, their hairpulling is more cautious than the vicious displays of emotion in the rematch. You can regard it as the background that explains the animosity that has developed between them.

Eva vs Rene develops just as you'd expect from the preview photos. I bought it to see Eva's bitchy side, and had that wish satisfied.

Eva vs Andy is emphatically NOT recommended. Eva's obviously not feeling very well, and Andy is not photogenic.

Notable fights that I haven't seen include the one against catfight queen Jana, which apparently turned into full-scale humiliation. I might buy it if there's ever a rematch where a more skilled Eva can hold her own. The rematch with Rene starts out in matching miniskirts, so part of me really wants to see it, but it's too predictable. Also, there are several erotic "tribbing" fights for those of you who like that kind of stuff. Search for "Eva" on the Tribgirls site.

Panther100 · Veteran Member

Tomas, per those parts of your latest post regarding my points:

1) We're basically on the same page here talkin' about standards. I agree an (objective) standard is an (objective) standard that has to be honored if it's legal (or should be honored even if it's just a nonbinding but generally accepted standard). Going beyond what I said before, if an advertisement or label says something and there are false parameters at stake to contradict the standard in question, then I suppose that is reason in and of itself for a pro to make correction or "clarify." To me it's more plausible that, yes, DWW was inspired--as you say--by all this HD-craze without fully realizing the import of what the HD standard means. Again, I follow what you mean by amateurish given their rank quality, so I'd only say what should probably be added to that is simply a case of their use of HD-hype and its enticement for sales: the most obvious answer is a simple answer to a simple case of "why did they do this ? ". I agree with your point about being pissed off if the lack of HD quality had been an objective factor in influencing your decision to buy.

2) About catalog size and its bearing on purchases:

First off, of course if you buy (what-turns-out-to-be-in-your-view) a bad product, you think twice before buying again, but you never know that unless you buy it (or otherwise see it or rely on reviews). If a pro makes a 100 good products and 100 bad one's, he's gonna have to make the 100 (or at least some significant fraction thereof) "bad" one's in order to know they're" bad" or else he or she isn't gonna know. Then he or she will decide accordingly what to do (and if they're "bad," -- meaning few or no sales, they're history). Even if all of us fem-vs-fem fans have a core similarity of what we like, considering all the genres and scenarios out there, we fans can be very selective about what satisfies us. Any pro is obviously gonna have to make decisions about what to retain or discard, but when the Kents and Panther100s of this world want to buy something and we discover it's been 404'd, now what's the point talkin' about quality ??? ... There is none, since a fan can't buy what he or she wants because it's no longer offerred. So much for a shrunken catalog size; the missing products didn't and wouldn't currently hurt those who were uninterested in them in the beginning (in the past they would have just skipped over them), but now those who were wondering, "Where in the hell is that product I've always wanted, it was in here a while ago ??? " are surely keepin' their money to themselves. I know decisions about whether or not a particular product is worth retaining have to made all the time; I'm just sayin' that when you deal with the multitude of desires and satisfactions of a crowd like us, the gross quantities of products can't be necessarliy struck out separately from the "quality" of genres for the sake of keeping happy customers. (You say it's partly a question of taste ... I'd definitely expand that and say it's heavily a question of taste.) I'd say they're both on par with each other, or at least they have to be considered on a complementary basis, imho.

G.R. is always a straight-shooter; I expect he'll have more to say about DWW's use of the HD-DVD production standard as time goes by ...

tomas · Senior Member

Panther, I pretty much agree with the essentials of what you're saying.

Yes, deleted products are a nuisance. (In fact, this is why I tend to start snarling every time somebody mentions the music industry.) Kent said he's bitter about not getting Eva's Evolution - I have the same problem myself with the first "Greek" catfight video.

Yes, it's impossible for a producer to tell in advance with certainty whether the fight he's about to film will be successful or not.

Yes, I understated it when I said it was "partly" a matter of taste. I'm all in favour of variety and catering to specific demands. In this respect, the catalogue only needs to be better organized, not trimmed. Guenter has announced that he's taking steps towards a very detailed search function, and has even requested from web club members that they suggest what search fields they'd like to see included.

Still, I bet there are 300 fights in the current DWW catalogue that follow the same pattern. They're filmed in that Hungarian basement (or whatever it is), on a blue mat, with two pretty women, topless and in thongs, fighting it out for pins and submissions (by body scissors only). Releasing all of those wasn't a matter of variety. Some of them are intense, emotional encounters where the women care about the outcome. Some are lacklustre fights where the women are simply going through the motions. I believe there's only a negligible number of catfight fans who'd prefer the latter, but you can't tell which fights fall into that category until you buy one and watch it.

Anyway, I remembered that DWW is offering a special membership for $8/month that gives you access to all web club content except the fights of the month. This content includes preview clips of most fights released the past two years or so. Kent, and anybody else who's thinking about buying something, you might want try that as a cheap (although not free) way to sample their videos. It would probably prove more useful than the brief rundown on Eva's fights that I gave above.

Also, the Christmas Counter is offering free one-minute clips until Christmas.

tomas · Senior Member

Today's preview clip features Eva pinning and getting pinned:

http://www.dww.at/dww/cc2007/open.asp?day=14

Unfortunately you don't get a good look at her face. She's fighting Leslie, who is described as an "erotic fighter" even in her straight wrestling clips. I don't know what that means exactly, maybe she's a moaner.

tomas · Senior Member

To follow up on the previous posts:

It's no longer the case that the fights in DWW's "movies" series are downloads only. They just released close to 200 DVDs, each containing one single fight for about $15-25. This strikes me as overkill, but maybe they struck a good deal with some DVD factory.

And on the topic of unreleased material, today's free clip is Luzia vs (the "other") Eva from an unreleased video:

http://www.dww.at/dww/cc2007/open.asp?day=21

Such exquisite moans, and it's just collecting dust in their archives. Green Monster would kill for such fights. Get it before Christmas or it's gone forever.

tomas · Senior Member

It seems the hairpulling rematch between Eva and Marketa that was the occasion of this thread was so favourably received that DWW has now released, not one, but three further rematches between the same girls:

http://www.dww.at/movies/movies_videos.asp?Product=MOVIES-272
http://www.dww.at/movies/movies_videos.asp?Product=MOVIES-273
http://www.dww.at/movies/movies_videos.asp?Product=MOVIES-274

I am of course overjoyed that my two favourites hate each other's guts and aren't afraid to show it, but my objection to the quality of the writing still stands. See the attached picture.

Kent · Senior Member

So this makes 4 times they have fought? Nice. I still have to get some of Eva's matches, but it's hard to decide which first with all the ones you describe.

tomas · Senior Member

Eva and Marketa have fought five matches: 168, 258, 272, 273, and 274, although a couple of those last three videos might have been shot on the same day. If you follow the links, you can read several reviews describing the action in some detail. The last fights all have custom rules, so read the descriptions to see if you're interested in those particular styles.

My favourite among Eva's videos is still the one against Monika, number 43, but the reservations I made earlier in this thread still apply.

If you want to see Eva's rivalry with Marketa, I'd go with number 258 - which DWW has shrewdly priced at eight credits, rather than the normal five or six for a video of that length. Despite this, it was announced as the company's best-selling video for last year. Curiously, according to the owner's comments in the web club forum, it's Marketa who has the larger fan base and seems to account for most of the sales. I really would have guessed that Eva had more universal appeal.

By the way, Kent. I just remembered that I saw a short excerpt from one of Eva's Tribgirls videos on your blog a few months ago, so she's not altogether new to you. Perhaps you didn't recognize her in Youtube's low resolution? It was the one with two girls arguing, teasing each other, and then wrestling on a bed.

Dionysus · Senior Member

Eva N. Marketa K. & HD

Hello, must say, I found this message thread rather interesting and thanks Tomas for taking the time to create it.

First off, 'HD'.

'HD' is synonymous with Blu-Ray and HD DVD formats, (with regards to media on discs) both of which DWW do not produce. Therefore DWW do not produce any HD format discs of their productions, even though they advertise that they do. To be fair and sympathetic with DWW, I don't think this is deliberately done to mislead you, rather it's another example of DWW's well known poor translations into the English language.

I believe DWW are attempting to indicate that their productions are of a very high digital quality, i.e. they are now filmed on digital equipment (possibly HD), then digitally edited, and then digitally transferred onto a DVD disc. The limitations of G.R.'s written English abilities mistranslates the quality of the DVD disc as being HD. However, you cannot have any HD productions on DVD format, that's technically impossible, that is the exclusive reserve of Blu-Ray and HD DVD discs, of which DWW do not yet produce.

As Tomas points out, you need a minimum of 720 for something to be HD and, but as I have just indicated above, HD means (with reference to HD on disc)Blu-Ray or HD-DVD (the latter now being a defunct format since Feb 19th 2008 when Toshiba discontinued HD DVD).

Therefore, DWW seem to have utilized the tag: 'HD' to express that their productions are of a very high quality, which they definitely are, even better when they are in widescreen. I can vouch for this, but they are definitely not HD, until that is DWW produces their fights on Blu-Ray, which they probably will in the next few years as Blu-Ray is now predicted to replace the low def DVD format entirely by 2012.

Now then, Marketa K. and Eva. N - I'd just like to say that if anyone who is interested in in female fighting and catfighting is reading this. The catfight #258 is a scuffle EVERYONE must have in their collection. Think Andy vs. Michelle (Crystal), Vira vs. Jenn/Summer (ECNWC).... the type of catfight that matches two equally sexy very hot women in an extremely competitive fight to deterime who's best and they both go at it with absolutely impressive gusto.

These two are the jewel in DWW's eye. It's an amazing scrap and breathtaking in it's turn on factor. Disc #272, I would also recommend as an excellent compliment to #258 too.

Toodle pip

Dio

-- Edited by Dionysus at 14:02, 2008-02-26

tomas · Senior Member

I thought I should add in postscript to this thread that, in recent discussions at Catfight-fans.de, Guenter has made it clear that he is indeed informed about developments in high-definition video. He's been using the term "HD" in his advertising to indicate that all his fights are now being filmed, although not released, in high definition. As I understand it, compressing high-definition video to lower resolution will yield better, crisper results than filming it in the lower resolution, so Guenter is not at fault in making a point out of it. However, there is a tangible loss of quality concerned, and it was still misleading of him not to qualify the information in his ads as "filmed in HD". Guenter's rationale for not releasing the fights in high definition is also suspect, as he believes his customers don't have Internet connections stable enough to download such huge files. Obviously he ought to know that it's a simple matter to split video files into separate parts and join them together again. He must be concerned about his bandwidth expenses.

Now, I've only been able to find one catfight producer who is offering videos in HD resolution (albeit 720p, not the 1080p of full HD). Guess who? It's... Manila Fights. I'd never heard of them until today. For those of you whose only impressions of Philippine catfights are the "Asian Connection" fillers in Crystal's Video Magazines, this will come as a revelation. These are not the boyish, squat, flat-chested girls you will remember, but quite attractive young women. The fights, on other the hand, seem somewhat tentative, so I'm holding on to my wallet for the moment.

In the more "decent" area of proper mixed martial arts, Bodog Fight is offering scores of free fights in HD definition, some of them with women. Here is a direct link to the download of Julie Kedzie vs Jan Finney (364 MB):

http://fight.bmediaserver.com/vault/bodog-fight-vault-finney-kedzie-720p.mov

Beware that this requires a fairly powerful computer and won't play on a vintage machine.

-- Edited by tomas at 10:54, 2008-04-20